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Author Topic: saying hello and asking a question (probably in the worng place)  (Read 4633 times)
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asuguy1
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« on: January 23, 2008, 09:02:03 PM »

so, hello.
new guy here - some friends and i are considering (if the process works out like we hope) starting a kiva group. i looked through the groups section and am a little confused. as i understand it (and i'm sure i don't understand it) a "group" can only be formed by sending $1000 to kiva. okay, i can dig that (though i may not understand it fully). it's what happens after that that confuses me. so, do we have complete control over that fund? can we send microloans of $100 each to 10 different businesses? or $50 each to 20? or even $25 each to 40? is all this done through paypal or through an account that kiva oversees? as a student organization, the torch will have to eventually be passed to someone else, so how would Kiva's structure fit in with that? easy? not so easy? what kind of access to the members have to keep tabs on the loans that the group is sending and receiving?

so, anyway, there's a few of my questions.

i am very excited about this whole thing. i can't wait to get involved and begin working to get others involved.

thanks for the help and thank you Kiva for changing the world!
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reb-mar
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« Reply To This #1 on: January 24, 2008, 12:12:22 AM »

Hello and welcome,  Wave
I don't know the answer to your questions as I'm fairly new also. Didn't know that you could make group loans and don't know if it's any different than an individual making a loan. I believe that you can only make loans of $25.00 per business. Unless they have changed that. When you click on a loan it will tell you the available options. The loans go through Kiva but the money is processed through PayPal. PayPal is donating their services for this! What fun you will have with the lending! Group lending sounds like it could be fun.
Will you all get together and have "Kiva Nights" to decide on the loans?
                 I hope that someone else will see this and fill you in on any additional info.

                                                       Welcome
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The difference between what we do and what we are capable of doing would suffice to solve most of the world's problems.
                   Mohandas Gandhi
charity
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« Reply To This #2 on: January 24, 2008, 03:14:46 AM »

Well, I too am fairly new to Kiva, but I have been spending tons of time looking on Kiva, Kiva journals, KivaFriends, Kivapedia, Kiva Lender pages, Kiva 'About' pages....(probably way too much time!  Wink )    So far, I have never seen anything that specifies any requirements for lending to Kiva as a group.  I could be wrong, but it was my impression that the Group lenders that have Kiva Lender pages and are listed in Kivapedia as "Group" lenders, were set up just as any individual would set up a Kiva account - i.e. Kiva couldn't tell the difference between an individual and a group, except the name and picture might indicate that.   I assumed that all these groups just worked with the money within the group, and then lent just like an individual would.   Hopefully someone with more internal Kiva experience or a person who is part of a group can comment on this...
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Tatiana
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« Reply To This #3 on: January 24, 2008, 06:36:04 AM »

Welcome

I think Charity is right.

I thought the $1000 dollar thing was about checks. If you want to send Kiva a check it has to be minimum $1000, because checks mean extra work and/or extra costs for them.

But if you are able to use paypal you can start a group already with only one $25 loan I think.
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Jill
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« Reply To This #4 on: January 24, 2008, 08:08:37 AM »

      Dear asuguy1,
      It's really Wonderful that you and your friends are already so "other-centered" that you want to start up a Kiva lending group.
As a one-time teacher who wondered if some of my students ever were going to realize that there were other people in the world besides them, that the entire world didn't necessarily, always revolve around them, I believe it's particularly special when young people look out into the world beyond themselves and want to try to do something to help.

      To try to answer at least a couple of your questions:

1) I'm close to positive, myself, that the $1,000 minimum pertained only to the situation where people wanted to make loans by sending
    checks to Kiva, rather than through the more common means of using PayPal, as Tatiana suggested.  $25 or any greater amount in increments
    of $25 should be enough to get you on your Kiva way.

2) And, as reb-mar suggested, at least, for now, Kiva has a maximum $25 loaning limit restricting what individual (and, apparently)
    group lenders can loan to an individual Entrepreneur.  The limit is sporadically imposed when it seems like there are many many more
    people out there wanting to get/to be involved with Kiva and fewer Entrepreneurs, or Borrowers, to make loans to.  The idea behind it is
    that Kiva wants to make sure that everybody, particularly newcomers to the site, has the opportunity to participate (and become hooked!).
    In the past, Kiva has removed the limit when the mad rush from either holidays or particularly widespread publicity has quieted down.

3) Whether there is another means for availing funds for loaning, apart from using PayPal or from sending Kiva a check of a minimum of $1,000, I'm not sure.  I think a person can make loans, merely using one of the standard credit cards, but I'll defer to another Kiva Friend who might have
more knowledge on that one.  (As to the requirement that any checks sent to Kiva for lending purposes be of an amount no less than $1,000,
the rationale behind that one, apparently, is that the organization doesn't have a large enough staff, yet, to have it be cost-effective for them to deal with the extra work required by the receipt of checks when there are less labor-intensive alternatives, like opening an account through PayPal, to accomplish the same objective).

4) As for whether successive groups of students can have access to your student account, at least for the purpose of allowing them to see which Entrepreneurs the group, historically, has made loans to, who, of them, has paid off in full, and who has paid off in part, the availability and sharing of the Group's Lender Page URL should be enough to enable students who come after to see that information. Check out this "random" example (smiley guy) of a Lender page to see what kind of information those later students would be able to access.... http://www.kiva.org/app.php?page=lender&action=view&name=jill1766&rdr


5) The more challenging question, as I understand it, is:
How Can a Student Group Open Up a Group Lending Account When the Individual, Who Opens the Account, Inevitably (well, at least, hopefully) Will Be Graduating, and The Students -- Who Initiated the Account -- Want That Group Lending Account to Survive Into Perpetuity.... or, at least, beyond their own graduation dates?

     A teacher/professor, on one of the existing Student Lending Groups and I corresponded with one another, and he wrote the following, which, I think, remains an unsolved issue:
".... If you wanted to do something useful, you could encourage the kiva people to make it easier for groups to 'lend' -- as it is now, one student took all the responsibility, which is hard for an 18-y.old (I can't handle student money), but she could at any time terminate the program and withdraw the funds.  She won't -- she's a great kid -- but that's how the system's set up...."

    I did forward his e-mail to the Kiva people a couple of weeks ago, but didn't ask them for a reply.  As this very clearly has been and will continue to be a significant issue, as long as student groups want to form Lending groups and as long as teachers can't, legally, handle the students' money, I, too, would suggest that you get in touch with Kiva, directly, and specifically call their attention to this issue and request their guidance on it.

    Don't worry, if you have any more questions here, anybody and everybody else, with the possible exception of our KivaFriend, Steve, will have a Much Much shorter reply to your inquiry.

    Super good luck,
     Jill

     All right, now, you understand, don't you, that part of the deal is that you guys "have to" become active participants of the Forum here and participate and post up a storm on a regular basis, right?  Well, I suppose that that's not a requirement, exactly, but it sure would be great.... and a boon to all of us.... if you would.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2008, 08:23:55 AM by Jill » Logged
QueenOfHearts
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« Reply To This #5 on: January 24, 2008, 08:19:36 AM »

As a member of the Kiva Shopping Club I can hopefully answer some of your questions.  I also post on Kivapedia in the Group listings. 

Anyone can start a group.  It can be work related, school related or just a bunch of friends.  As in KSC, one person (Henry) creates the group lending page with a unique email address.  It is up to the group who has access to the account...i.e. a school group would only be accessed by a teacher.

The $1000 amount refers to opening a Kiva Lender account for someone who does not have access to pay pal such as someone with no internet connection.  You can start your group with the minimum loan amount of $25.00 just as any other lender.

Hope this helps ....if not keep asking.  Queen
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KivanSteven
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« Reply To This #6 on: January 24, 2008, 08:55:49 AM »

         Don't worry, if you have any more questions here, anybody and everybody else, with the possible exception of our KivaFriend, Steve, will have a Much Much shorter reply to your inquiry.

    Super good luck,
     Jill


Thanks for the nod Jill Wink  Ive toned it down the last month or so have I not  Cheesy 

Asuguy, great to hear of your plans.  Group lending, especially school based lending, has the potential to be a really powerful movement within Kiva, once it is better structured and differentiated in ways from individual lending.  One option, supposing upon graduation there is not a satisfiable group to take the reigns from you, is to eventually, whenever deemed appropriate, withdraw the loan amounts after full repayment and donate the funds to Kiva.  If anything, that should prevent people from being skeptical about what happens with the funds and who receives them after the original group you have created is dissolved.

See Jill, Im behaving myself  Tongue
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I find not direction in the readings of those with whom my eccentricities are similar, but rather validation.

My only solace is that I find a peaceful place where I might be resigned to my depriving loneliness.
charity
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« Reply To This #7 on: January 28, 2008, 05:20:18 PM »

I don't know if this helps, or really how to do it...  but today I was listening to the Kiva Podcast from 4/3/07.  They were interviewing a woman who works for Kiva, and she talked briefly about a group of lenders called "Agents of Change" (http://www.kiva.org/lender/agentsofchange)
that sounds like a student group that fundraises to lend money.  The woman from Kiva made it sound like the account was specifically set up so that the money could not ever be withdrawn from Kiva, just relent or donated to Kiva.   So you wouldn't have to worry about an unethical current or future participant withdrawing the money for their own betterment.  I don't know how you would set that up, or if Kiva actually does that on a regular basis.  Plus, your group would have to be certain they wanted their money to be in Kiva loans forever!
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KivanSteven
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« Reply To This #8 on: January 28, 2008, 05:37:46 PM »

Hi Charity, the people behind that group are actually KivaFriends as well

http://www.kivafriends.org/index.php?action=profile;u=494

They just posted on the forum recently briefly describing their plans to raise money and awareness for Kiva.

http://www.kivafriends.org/index.php/topic,1133.msg21374.html#msg21374
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I find not direction in the readings of those with whom my eccentricities are similar, but rather validation.

My only solace is that I find a peaceful place where I might be resigned to my depriving loneliness.
Agent001
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www.educationgeneration.org & www.globalafc.org

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« Reply To This #9 on: January 31, 2008, 06:05:36 PM »

I suspect we've talked with Kiva about this in more depth than most...they're loosely beginning to plan for a more robust group lending platform to make this type of effort easier and more transparent and we've provided some input based on our experiences.

asuguy1, feel free to contact with any specific questions and will see what I can answer! We're also working here in Canada, and with a group out of Stanford, to create a loosley united student fundraising, engagement, and Kiva lending effort across the continent so if that sounds interesting...

Cheers,

Shawn
www.agentsofchange.ca

(I hope including the website doesn't always look self-promoting more than necessary...but more useful info potentially there.)

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Huge supporter of Kiva at www.globalafc.org, and providing scholarships to developing world youth at www.educationgeneration.org
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