Kiva Looking into Group Lending Functionality

[Guest]

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[Agent001]

Hi crew,

Kiva is working on building certain functionality in for groups, companies, etc to more effectively link their communal fundraising efforts, for teachers to more effectively use this as a tool, groups to share control over accounts and possible dual level access passwords (one for lending, one for passwords/withdrawals etc).

We've been in discussion with them as these are features our group desperately needs to continue managing our growing fund. If anyone ELSE is working with groups and thinks these may be useful, please get in touch as Kiva is actively seeking to see how needed this functionality is!

Cheers,

Shawn Smith
www.agentsofchange.ca

[Henry]

I'm with you on this, I'm pushing for two different reasons.  KSC, and another project of mine.

Here was my KIVA response when asked for a multi level access account.... I'm sure you've seen similar!
(sadly, i think she thought I was a newbie to KIVA, and answered as such.  I let it ride, at the moment for me it's not an urgent issue, I do look forward to the day, we can have an account with different level passwords)

Actually forget the passwords, I'd be happy with an account set up as non-withdrawable without written permission from the account owner.  This should be something that could be done right away. 

Dear Henry,

Thank you very much for your interest in Kiva.org!

Many groups lend together through Kiva.org. However, we are still
working on a formal group feature for the website -- so at this point,
it is not possible for us to collect and aggregate payments for one
account. However, you can designate one individual to be your group's
account administrator who manages the payment process and receives all
email updates from Kiva.org. It is up to you how you want to pool
your money together, but please note that in an effort to keep our
operational expenses low, we only accepts checks for amounts
over $1000.

Once you have set up the account, you can share the URL for your
lender page with your group members. This lender page will display the loans in your group's portfolio, and it will also display what amount of
money has been repaid by each business. And remember, from your lender page, your members will be able to click on the name of a business and view the business' profile page where all journal entries are posted.

You can make the URL for your lender page reflect the name of your group by entering the name of your group in the first name and last name boxes that appear during the setup process. You also have the
opportunity to create a lender name that reflects the spirit of your
group when you create your account.

[Agent001]

Hi Henry,

Glad to hear from you! We have spoken quite closely with Kiva for some time, visiting more than once. I'd love to get a collective push going to make this functionality a reality, as our situation will become fairly unmanageable in short order.

The dual level password is huge for us...we will be administering up to $100,000 in Kiva loans as early as this summer and growing quickly...and the whole point is that the youth raising it get to control it...which is tough when anyone with the password can withdraw the funds. An account thats non-withdrawable without written permission would be amazing, basically, as a first step.

The problem at Kiva, I'm assuming, is that as as soon as they set an account up as non-withdrawable it automatically triggers a different legal distinction in the org - it becomes THEIR money legally, hence the ability to issue tax receipts for it. The functionality hasn't been seperated from the legality, but seems a simple enough step from a distance.

Kiva is officially moving forward with an aggregate lending feature, so affiliated people with individual accounts can recognize their collective input. A good step, but not really helpful for our situation.

What's your other project if you don't mind my asking?

My direct contact at Kiva for this project is Roma Jhaveri, her email follows the usual Kiva.org first name pattern. She's quite receptive to getting input around building this in a meaningful way and has asked me to forward people to discuss with her.

We all know Kiva does a LOT with relatively minimal resources, but I really think this is an important one for them and definitely is for us.

Shawn

[cpbailey]

Shawn,

I think there are a number of groups that might use the functionality if it were available.  Kiva Shopping group might benefit, for example.  I would think school groups would have an issue with allow students to have access to the account and not have accountability, so having the current system could PREVENT some organizations from being able to participate.  (Schools and other organizations want clear responsibility and money trails)

Colette

[Agent001]

That's essentially our problem. We can't let ANYONE into the system to manage the account without supervision...and there are well over 100 young people directly involved in supporting/fundraising/cycling to mexico as the case may be.

I know, our fault for counting on a functionality that isn't there...but we're looking for solutions, haha 

[AccountAbility]

Shawn , On another thread here someplace (can't find it right now) I thought you said that non-withdrawable accounts were already available.  You just need to write to Kiva to set it up that way.  I was very interested in that, since there are all sorts of situations that need that sort of thing.  Parents and Grandparents setting up "children" accounts and funding them is another arena that would benefit.

So long as there was a provision that left the right of someone on the lender side to withdraw Kiva credits, I cannot see why this would lead to turning control over to Kiva.  It still is lender monies--just a more formal procedure and identification to withdraw.  This is not that different from business bank accounts with predetermined authorized persons.  If that can be automated with multi-level logins, then so much the better.

Dan

[Agent001]

Shawn , On another thread here someplace (can't find it right now) I thought you said that non-withdrawable accounts were already available.  You just need to write to Kiva to set it up that way.  I was very interested in that, since there are all sorts of situations that need that sort of thing.  Parents and Grandparents setting up "children" accounts and funding them is another arena that would benefit.

So long as there was a provision that left the right of someone on the lender side to withdraw Kiva credits, I cannot see why this would lead to turning control over to Kiva.  It still is lender monies--just a more formal procedure and identification to withdraw.  This is not that different from business bank accounts with predetermined authorized persons.  If that can be automated with multi-level logins, then so much the better.

Dan

Hi Dan,

It is entirely possible to set up non-withdrawable accounts, but they are permanently non-withdrawable. In Kiva's books, it becomes their money, though you retain control over lending (but not withdrawal) decisions. As a Canadian charity, we can't even legally do this, as without the right to withdraw in any way its simply a donation to Kiva (cross-border).

Something similar to a business bank account with pre-determined authorized persons, or multi-level logins in an ideal world, is exactly what we're hoping for but currently this is not possible. Its either wide-open to withdrawal with the single password and no further controls, or locked permanently in Kiva, and legally classified as a donation and not a loan.

Glad to hear a few people thinking about this one!

Shawn

[AccountAbility]

Thanks for the clarification.  I too think this is an important enhancement that Kiva should work on.  It might require a more sophisticated login system, but opens the door to many possibilities where there needs to be a secondary login with less privileges.

Dan

[roma]

Hi folks,

Thanks for your feedback on this -- agreed that it would be an important and valuable piece of functionality to add.

As an initial step, we're thinking that it might make sense to provide a simple way for individual lenders to band themselves together under a particular group affiliation. For example, there could be a KivaFriends group, which everyone on this forum could join while still maintaining their own accounts. This way, you get the fun of working together as a team to alleviate poverty but can continue with your individual impact -- if you choose to join the group.

The question I have is whether anonymous lenders -- people who choose to be displayed as Anonymous -- would be interested in joining one of these groups? So far, from the people we've surveyed, the answer has been no. Any anonymous lenders here with input?

Thanks again for all your help.

[Henry]

Hey Roma, glad to see your working on this. 

I can only speak for the KSC needs, this direction your headed WILL NOT help us.  And, I don't see much benefit in the direction your headed.  I'm not even sure where this idea came about from any of the suggestions given.

of course, i can sometimes be narrowminded!  LOL